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Post by deb on Oct 30, 2015 6:11:53 GMT -5
THIS IS A DEBATES AREA THREAD PLEASE READ BELOW
lets come together to share our thoughts about tonight's episode!
Lets discuss:
What did you like?
What you did not like?
What was your favorite scene/quote?
What scene was the most shocking to you or caught you off guard?
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Post by demetra on Oct 30, 2015 6:28:54 GMT -5
What did you like?
Plus favourite line -- Damon: "And that's why I drink bourbon": HUGE LAUGH.
Candice King's performance was adeptly comedic and very enjoyable throughout.
The last five minutes, which really saved the episode.
Loved that they included the ghost tour phenomenon, pretty referential to the impact TVD has had on poor Covington, Georgia?
Oscar.
Was glad to see Stefan and Caroline finally get their shine on. Interesting that it was back story, tho, and not a pivotal emotional moment.
THE RETURN OF JO. Oh, I hope she gets to do more. Her return seemed most reminiscent of Elena's.
What did you not like?
The three Heretic girls are still pretty, blank and pretty indistinguishable. The British accents seem unnecessary. It seems like they have one extra character in there -- maybe Valerie could have been both Stefan's undoing and one of the new couple?
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Kiki
Team Stefan
Posts: 2,953
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Post by Kiki on Oct 30, 2015 8:59:30 GMT -5
Not as good as last weeks episode but still not bad.
What did I like?
Stefan calling Damon out on the mess he caused with Oscar and asking him to clean it up himself but then helping him anyway.
I liked the moment when the spell was removed and Caroline and Stefan were finally able to kiss again. I'm still not 100% on the Steroline train but I guess I'm getting there.
The Bonnie - Caroline moment at the beginning was nice, too. Caroline didn't ask and didn't want Bonnie to find the spell for her skinproblem but wanted some normal friendship time with her instead. Finally someone who wants Bonnie's friendship and not her magic.
What I did not like..
When that studentgirl came to Damon and Stefan with the note from Nora both didn't worry at all that she killed herself and didn't try to save her. Yet a few minutes later when Mary Louise threw the sissors into that guy Stefan and Caroline jumped at him to heal him with their blood. So do they still worry about collateral damage or not?? Decide one way or the other I don't care since it's a vampire show but do it one way OR the other not both ways.
I agree there are too many heretics. You cannot focus on all of them. Valerie seems interesting but Nora and Mary Louise not so much. I guess they needed many to kill some off. I'm sure we'll see more dead Heretics soon and might only keep 2 or 3 in the end which will make it easier to follow.
Why again was saving Oscar to get Elena's coffin back more importand than getting Joe (incl. 2 unborn babies) back? Is Elena's life worth more than any other life? Why didn't they at least discuss it? How could they know that the stone works multiple times? Well at least Damon seems to realize that he was a selfish friend in the end.
Damon thinking that he was a jealous brother didn't hit the nail for me. Maybe if you see it for the whole 7 seasons yes he was jealous about Stefan and Elena's love and wanted to steal this happiness from Stefan which he did. But for this episode or season 7 I don't think he was jealous but more unsympathetic towards Stefan and his worry about Caroline
I love that Joe is back but somehow it makes the fact that the other side is gone less powerful. We can still bring back dead people. But having Joe back is interesting. I am glad she's back
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amimi
Team Stefan
Posts: 164
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Post by amimi on Oct 30, 2015 14:28:04 GMT -5
I gave this episode a 4 - honestly I loved it. I laughed out loud more than once. I cried at the end. The only thing that kept me from giving it a 5 is the Heretic storyline which has not been all that interesting so far... What I liked:Just about everything! The end - I may be Team Stefan but Damon's letter and his self-reflection were so lovely, and his 'letting go' of Elena was very sad! I'm sad for Damon, OK guys? He wanted and needed her love for so long and now he has to let go. And anytime the story sort of pays homage to its past (in this case the saga of the DE relationship) I get weepy because I'm reminded of how long I've loved this show! Ric/twins/resurrection - I'm so happy they've given him this storyline, he deserves a compelling and exciting (although tragic) story again. Remember the end of S3 and his human death? One of my favorite scenes. Damon in the future - what's going on with him? why is acting so creepy again? Enzo/Valerie team-up - I like their dynamic and I'm exciting to see where it will go. A possible future pairing? Stefan and Caroline - enough of us are willing to go for this ride so I'll just come out and say that I think they are wonderful - I agree the chemistry is ...different than it was with SE, but I find them really sweet, sexy, and their relationship just seems very human and authentic. And Stefan's line about "we've had more history in the past 5 years than most people have in a lifetime" was great. It's nice to see him happy, even though PW thinks it's boring! What I didn't like:I just want to Enzo to have a better storyline that's not piggybacking on someone else's. But the Valerie team-up looks promising. Mary Louise and Nora were slightly more interesting than in prior weeks but not by much...I don't see much chemistry between the actresses and they're not selling me on their relationship. That kiss was lame. I was hoping we'd get more of the Oscar we met last week, less Ripper and more Vegas. Lily needs to be more scary. Maybe her connection with Julian will make that happen.... I have high hopes that he will be a genuine threat. Kiki when Damon calls himself a "jealous brother" he is referring to the way he was in the past regarding Stefan and Elena (and Katherine too). It's not about Stefan's current relationship with Caroline. The thing I didn't understand is why he called himself a "horrible son" - that made me really sad - why would he say that about himself? Do you think he believes it?
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Post by crimmyj on Oct 30, 2015 15:41:04 GMT -5
poor Paul Wesley.
There are too many heretics, and maybe only two of them are interesting. Those 2 aren't ML and Nora, what so ever. There heretics as villains are also pretty worthless. You guys are witches AND vampires, you should be fierce and not so easy to take out.
At least the show finally recognizes that they haven't developed Damon's character in 6 seasons as anything more than a love obsessed vampire. I would like to hope that this will yield a new journey of self discovery but they pulled this trick before with Damon when he had a moment of self awareness and then nothing came of it. and now even the other characters on this show are being shown with little forward progression, Caroline back to annoyingly insecure lapdog to a guy. Bonnie isn't the independent badass witch, but again the magical doormat for her new bffs. and Matt is still Matt...and Tyler is an uber driver?
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Post by Evers17 on Oct 31, 2015 3:05:54 GMT -5
I enjoyed that episode. This season has got me doing ALOT of guess work about where they are taking us. It would be a pity (and I read opinions in other posts) if they ended on season 7. I think they have great potential to build up the dynamic of the show and give the main characters some very interesting story lines..... Ok so I have to say when I heard Julian say Valerie was preggers I ultimately thought "holy heck future assassin is Stefan's child!" BUT that was quickly laid to rest by Valarie losing the baby.... Then I thought maybe Julian is dead and that's why Lily really wants the Phoenix stone.... I liked Stefan and Caroline working together and being able to get it on finally under normal circumstances. I'm with Kiki, I'm slowly getting more into Steroline BUT that's probably because I don't want him to fall back into Valerie's clutches. I can buy the Valerie/Stefan storyline but if they turn it into more than a back story and it carries on into this big thing, it will sort of annoy me a bit I think! Though obviously there is going to be a talk between the two of them. And it's going to cause conflict between Steroline because there's no such thing as a smooth sailing relationship on TVD! I think Tyler taking Elena's coffin signals Damon moving on a bit so he can branch out in the storyline department. They did the obligatory few episodes of him being selfish and just trying to protect Elena's coffin etc etc and now hopefully with her removed he can have a bit more of an impact elsewhere and we can see him in that "protector" role maybe? Obviously we might see him with a glass of vino more often now and not his regular glass of bourbon? Argh!!! The whole Jo thing has me conflicted! I want Ric to have some happiness but I'm sure this is going to still end badly... What will she be like resurrected? There's got to be repercussions surely. Will she be herself or a bit sinister? The babies! If the flash forward is a truthful depiction and not an alternate universe or something of the likes, then the babies will be alive too! Maybe Caroline can just give birth to Jo's twins so Candice's pregnancy doesn't have to be hid (far fetched but hey anything is possible on this show). There def are too many Heretics. I think they need to get rid of ML or Nora because that will make one of them go mental. Look how easy Damon took out whats his face, was it Malcom? (Forgot his name already haha). Beau the mute hasn't really done much so far. I wish (and I know it's a far fetched wish because what reason would they have to return to MF's) Elijah and Klaus would come and visit and decapitate a couple! There'd be some good dialogue between those two and Lily I reckon And the only people we are yet to see in a flash forward are Bon Bon and Matt. What will they be doing I wonder....
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Kiki
Team Stefan
Posts: 2,953
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Post by Kiki on Oct 31, 2015 7:43:20 GMT -5
@evers17 If you are right and Damon will live up to his realisations and become a better brother & friend I might even start to like him again. If he would start to be a friend to Elena's friends because he wants friendship and not because he wants to please Elena I would like him. And if he cares about his brother's problems even if it means to put solving his own on pause I would even believe in the bromance again. I'm open for it... bring it on
I love to see Stefan in love. And if it's Caroline I'm ok with it. Stefan and Elena were epic but then she cheated on him and hurt him in every way she could. There are millions of couples who had the perfect marriage but then got divorced and found another love. So why not Stefan, too? I just hope we will not rush into the next lovetriangle with Valerie.
I think that Julian is dead, too. That's why Lily asked Enzo about the Phoenix stone. But where does the stone come from? And what are it's consequences? And... we saw Alaric's twindaughters alive in the flash forward. So the Phoenix stone brought not only Joe back but also her unborn children. Is there maybe a way it can bring back Valerie's unborn baby, too???
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amimi
Team Stefan
Posts: 164
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Post by amimi on Oct 31, 2015 10:16:47 GMT -5
"And... we saw Alaric's twindaughters alive in the flash forward. So the Phoenix stone brought not only Joe back but also her unborn children. Is there maybe a way it can bring back Valerie's unborn baby, too?" Kiki this would be amazing!! Oh I so hope they go this route. Stefan would be a wonderful father, despite how dangerous it is to bring children into their crazy universe...
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bonbon
Junior Member
Posts: 74
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Post by bonbon on Oct 31, 2015 14:18:02 GMT -5
At least the show finally recognizes that they haven't developed Damon's character in 6 seasons as anything more than a love obsessed vampire. I would like to hope that this will yield a new journey of self discovery but they pulled this trick before with Damon when he had a moment of self awareness and then nothing came of it. and now even the other characters on this show are being shown with little forward progression, Caroline back to annoyingly insecure lapdog to a guy. Bonnie isn't the independent badass witch, but again the magical doormat for her new bffs. and Matt is still Matt...and Tyler is an uber driver? So far I'm not feeling this season. I feel like they're moving backwards. Not liking the Phoenix stone storyline at all, and raising dead twins is just creepy and tragic. I hope they can turn this around because I do love this show. P.S, am I the only one who almost cried when stefan torched his car last episode? Literally NOOO! Out loud lol
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Post by jennifer on Oct 31, 2015 16:15:26 GMT -5
I gave this episode a 4 - honestly I loved it. I laughed out loud more than once. I cried at the end. The only thing that kept me from giving it a 5 is the Heretic storyline which has not been all that interesting so far... What I liked:Just about everything! The end - I may be Team Stefan but Damon's letter and his self-reflection were so lovely, and his 'letting go' of Elena was very sad! I'm sad for Damon, OK guys? He wanted and needed her love for so long and now he has to let go. And anytime the story sort of pays homage to its past (in this case the saga of the DE relationship) I get weepy because I'm reminded of how long I've loved this show!Ric/twins/resurrection - I'm so happy they've given him this storyline, he deserves a compelling and exciting (although tragic) story again. Remember the end of S3 and his human death? One of my favorite scenes. Damon in the future - what's going on with him? why is acting so creepy again? Enzo/Valerie team-up - I like their dynamic and I'm exciting to see where it will go. A possible future pairing? Stefan and Caroline - enough of us are willing to go for this ride so I'll just come out and say that I think they are wonderful - I agree the chemistry is ...different than it was with SE, but I find them really sweet, sexy, and their relationship just seems very human and authentic. And Stefan's line about "we've had more history in the past 5 years than most people have in a lifetime" was great. It's nice to see him happy, even though PW thinks it's boring! What I didn't like:I just want to Enzo to have a better storyline that's not piggybacking on someone else's. But the Valerie team-up looks promising. Mary Louise and Nora were slightly more interesting than in prior weeks but not by much...I don't see much chemistry between the actresses and they're not selling me on their relationship. That kiss was lame. I was hoping we'd get more of the Oscar we met last week, less Ripper and more Vegas. Lily needs to be more scary. Maybe her connection with Julian will make that happen.... I have high hopes that he will be a genuine threat. Kiki when Damon calls himself a "jealous brother" he is referring to the way he was in the past regarding Stefan and Elena (and Katherine too). It's not about Stefan's current relationship with Caroline. The thing I didn't understand is why he called himself a "horrible son" - that made me really sad - why would he say that about himself? Do you think he believes it?The end made the episode for me. The other parts were fine, they advanced the story, we finally got the Stefan/Caroline moment with their humanity intact. For the most part though, it felt like an episode cobbled together from previous eps. I'm always a sucker for TVD endings, when they get the music and the narrative just right, and last night was a good example. The only part I didn't understand or agree with was same as yours amimi - when was Damon a horrible son? I suppose it was killing the first heretic, then holding Oscar hostage, not really grasping that in his selfishness he was depriving Lily of her "real" sons. That's plain sad, to be replaced. It doesn't make Damon horrible to want to save who matters to him. Thank you for taking the coffin away Tyler! Finally. Also, very pleased Jo is back though guessing about the flash forwards - if they have truth to them - it looks like she has the twins but is out of the picture and Alaric is raising them. Died, turns into the bolt shooter....? Liked the homage to The Shining.
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Post by jennifer on Oct 31, 2015 16:23:11 GMT -5
At least the show finally recognizes that they haven't developed Damon's character in 6 seasons as anything more than a love obsessed vampire. I would like to hope that this will yield a new journey of self discovery but they pulled this trick before with Damon when he had a moment of self awareness and then nothing came of it. and now even the other characters on this show are being shown with little forward progression, Caroline back to annoyingly insecure lapdog to a guy. Bonnie isn't the independent badass witch, but again the magical doormat for her new bffs. and Matt is still Matt...and Tyler is an uber driver? So far I'm not feeling this season. I feel like they're moving backwards. Not liking the Phoenix stone storyline at all, and raising dead twins is just creepy and tragic. I hope they can turn this around because I do love this show. P.S, am I the only one who almost cried when stefan torched his car last episode? Literally NOOO! Out loud lol I forgot to mention the car last week. I was pissed off! If it actually happens that Stefan torches his Porsche, that feels like the last nail in the coffin of the early seasons. The symbolism for the Salvatore brothers will be gone if they leave their house, leave MF, then Stefan sets fire to his journals and his car. It could all be a ruse though, so I'm in wait-and-see mode about the future.
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Post by Evers17 on Oct 31, 2015 18:03:00 GMT -5
jennifer and bonbon I felt the same about Stefan's car! I was like whaaaaat is he doinggggg??? But he did keep a journal so will be interesting to find out what journal it is? An older one or current? Kiki I love your idea for the Phoenix stone possibly bringing back Valerie's child, BUT I think that would be a very tricky storyline to make believable... If they did pull it off well though - kudos! I only say that because Valerie was a human witch possibly in the very early stages of pregnancy and then baby was killed, and Valerie then turned is what I took away from last weeks ep? So bringing back that baby would be extremely challenging indeed. But then is the baby really dead? Valerie could've just told a version of the story to protect baby Salvatore to be? But the timing of the pregnancy, Valerie turning, their voyage etc doesn't really give Valerie time to carry a child that none of the heretics know about except Julian so she probably did lose it early on....
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Post by demetra on Oct 31, 2015 21:54:31 GMT -5
jennifer and bonbon I felt the same about Stefan's car! I was like whaaaaat is he doinggggg??? But he did keep a journal so will be interesting to find out what journal it is? An older one or current? Kiki I love your idea for the Phoenix stone possibly bringing back Valerie's child, BUT I think that would be a very tricky storyline to make believable... If they did pull it off well though - kudos! I only say that because Valerie was a human witch possibly in the very early stages of pregnancy and then baby was killed, and Valerie then turned is what I took away from last weeks ep? So bringing back that baby would be extremely challenging indeed. But then is the baby really dead? Valerie could've just told a version of the story to protect baby Salvatore to be? But the timing of the pregnancy, Valerie turning, their voyage etc doesn't really give Valerie time to carry a child that none of the heretics know about except Julian so she probably did lose it early on.... I'm not sure how reliable a narrator Valerie is...yet.
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Post by Ruby on Nov 1, 2015 9:48:15 GMT -5
So early on this season, im pretty sure Lily was looking for the pheonix stone. i couldve sworn she mentioned it.
What if Julian is dead and shes planning on bringing him back to life?
He didnt get locked up with them in the prison world..meaning he prob left them behind or his agenda was to get something from lily n once he got it he left anyway.
All these dang british accents tho make me feel im watching part of the originals hahah.
I wasnt around thursday so i didnt get to watch TVD UNTIL yesterday.
Overall im liking this season alot. I like the flash forwards n the lil hints here and there.
Sent from my SM-G900T using proboards
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Kiki
Team Stefan
Posts: 2,953
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Post by Kiki on Nov 1, 2015 13:18:19 GMT -5
So early on this season, im pretty sure Lily was looking for the pheonix stone. i couldve sworn she mentioned it. What if Julian is dead and shes planning on bringing him back to life? He didnt get locked up with them in the prison world..meaning he prob left them behind or his agenda was to get something from lily n once he got it he left anyway. All these dang british accents tho make me feel im watching part of the originals hahah. I wasnt around thursday so i didnt get to watch TVD UNTIL yesterday. Overall im liking this season alot. I like the flash forwards n the lil hints here and there. Sent from my SM-G900T using proboards Lily asked Enzo to find the Phoenix stone for her in that bar. And Valerie said to Oscar "I cannot let Lily bring him (Julian) back". That's what made me assume that Julian is dead and Lily needs the Phoenix stone for him I love the flashforwards and backwards, too. Gives a lot of material for guessinggames and that's what made me fall in love with this show
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